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In the media

Wikipedia is an extension of legacy media propaganda, says Elon Musk

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By Bri, Jonatan Svensson Glad, Oltrepier, and Smallbones

A Roman salute?

Detail from The Oath of the Horatii by Jacques-Louis David (1785). Painted in Rome for the French King Louis XVI, by a future revolutionary

A gesture made on stage by Elon Musk at the 2025 Donald Trump presidential inauguration was interpreted by some as a Nazi or Roman salute, and by others as an ambiguous wave. The Wikipedia article on the Elon Musk gesture controversy covers both possibilities, but this didn't prevent it from being the focus of attention in the media.

Neutrality-preserving processes at work

On Elon Musk's Wikipedia biography, a long paragraph about the controversy is currently included, following the closure of a request for comment on the article's talk page as accepting that a limited mention should be included. An articles for deletion nomination for Elon Musk's arm gesture was closed with a rough consensus to keep the article. Sarah Grevy Gotfredsen wrote for the Columbia Journalism Review that "Wikipedia's update on Musk's salute is a case in point" of the encyclopedia's neutrality in describing controversial events, as it "includes Musk's physical arm movement and how it was viewed by some as a Nazi gesture, but also notes that Musk denied such intent" (emphasis added).

Reactions, and reactions to reactions

The Independent reported that "Elon Musk was furious" after his Wikipedia page referred to his controversial gesture as a "Nazi salute":

(Musk) called out the online encyclopedia site on X after the gesticulation he made at a rally at the Capital One Arena was referred to as "a Nazi salute or fascist salute" on his Wikipedia page – something the Tesla/X CEO vehemently denies.

But the link to the "denial" is less than it first seemed. Also, Vanity Fair's article on the same matter said that "Elon Musk Sure Isn’t Denying That His Inaugural Gesture Was a Nazi Salute".

Numerous tweets were tweeted (or X'd). A Newsweek piece stated in its title that Wikipedia "fired back" at Musk, but it was actually talking about Jimmy Wales's response to a Musk tweet – both posts were linked to in the aforementioned Independent article:

I think Elon is unhappy that Wikipedia is not for sale. I hope his campaign to defund us results in lots of donations from people who care about the truth. If Elon wanted to help, he'd be encouraging kind and thoughtful intellectual people he agrees with to engage.

– Jimmy Wales

What is certain is that Musk's gesture caused different reactions within Jewish political organizations: The Forward – formerly known as Forverts when it was published in Yiddishquoted a "conciliatory" statement by the Anti-Defamation League, who said that Musk "made an awkward gesture in a moment of enthusiasm, not a Nazi salute". The ADL statement is discussed in the Wikipedia article about the controversy, which also mentions a former director of the association, Abraham Foxman, being at odds with their take. On the other hand, as reported by The Guardian, the head of the Jewish Council for Public Affairs, Amy Spitalnick, expressed more concern over the gesture, saying that "there was nothing ambiguous" about the salutes, and that they "should be enough to warrant condemnation and attention".

Swedish national public broadcaster Sveriges Television added more details about Musk's criticism of Wikipedia (in Swedish), highlighting his claim that the site relies on "legacy media propaganda" for sourcing. It also includes another direct response from Jimmy Wales, who defended Wikipedia's neutrality, stating that the article simply reports verifiable facts: Musk made the gesture, it was widely compared to a Nazi salute, and he denied any intent. Wales also took the opportunity to remind Musk of the failure of his supposed bid to buy Wikipedia.

And the truth is...

France 24 gave a comprehensive video analysis of Musk's gesture, while DW News (a channel of Deutsche Welle) stated what may be the last word on the meaning of the gesture. According to analyst Matthew Moore, "there's only one person I think that really knows whether this was a fascist salute, and that is Elon Musk".

B, JSG, O

Palestine-Israel Articles decision

The Anti-Defamation League (ADL) report on the Arbitration Committee's Palestine-Israel Articles 5 decision was the core of several stories in The Times of Israel and The Jerusalem Post, both Israeli media, as well as The Jewish Journal of Greater Los Angeles.

Several Wikipedians provided a mix of anonymous and attributed responses to the Jewish Journal, expressing a range of opinions from optimistic – "I like the idea of something like the article titles restriction...the vacuum [caused by bans of individuals] will be filled by experienced editors who have heretofore been afraid to edit in the topic area" – to ascerbic – "[it is] flabby and insufficient ... the arbs in general were lazy, robotic, and are utterly unsuited to provide 'adult supervision' of Wikipedia."

The decision was also covered by Jewish Telegraphic Agency (JTA), with less emphasis on the ADL commentary.

The JTA was in turn syndicated by several US newspapers, including Miami's South Florida Sun Sentinel (read here) and Brooklyn's Jewish Press (read here).

See related Signpost coverage at this issue's Arbitration report. – B

Big picture

Stephen Harrison's latest piece for Slate combines topics we also discuss below, most specifically the Heritage Foundation's plans to "identify and target" Wikipedia editors – see prior Signpost coverage – plus the aforementioned conclusion of an ArbCom case involving Israeli and Palestinian supporters.

Harrison noted how it is not encouraging that "in the long term, Wikipedians, and the rest of us, can ask for stronger privacy protections from both lawmakers and the companies", but "until then, there is not much that users can do to protect themselves from mass surveillance."

The beat reporter sees the Heritage's alleged plan to out editors as a form of harassment to force its views into contentious articles, fearing that, if these tactics were implemented and proved to be successful, they might drive away all but the most strident editors:

Faced with the risk of harassment or real-world retaliation, many volunteer editors—especially those covering politically sensitive topics—may simply stop contributing. Those who remain are likely to be the most ideologically driven voices, further eroding Wikipedia's stated goal of neutrality.

The free encyclopedia will become too toxic to sustain.

S

John Green's ties to AFC Wimbledon now officially acknowledged on his Wikipedia page

Jack Currie and John Green
Jack Currie could definitely tell how much John Green loves AFC Wimbledon... well, so does his Wikipedia page now!

In a recent video for the vlogbrothers YouTube channel, author and philantropist John Green recently shared more details about "something ridiculous", that is, the latest achievement of his charity community, Nerdfighteria: the completion of a real-life soccer transfer. Green, together with his wife and about 1,100 members of Nerdfighteria, helped English League Two club AFC Wimbledon pay for the transfer of Marcus Browne, having collected most of the money through donations on several livestreams hosted at Green's solo channel.

AFC Wimbledon was founded in 2002 by former fans of Wimbledon F.C., in dissent to the controversial relocation of the club to Milton Keynes, which eventually led to the foundation of MK Dons. The phoenix club is majority-owned by a fan association, the Dons Trust, and Green – despite being a life-long fan of Liverpool F.C. – has sponsored them since July 2014, when Nerdfighteria was first announced as a back-of-shorts sponsor.

In his video about the Browne transfer, Green stated that supporting AFC Wimbledon was "one of my great achievements of my life", and that he had "no idea why it's not on my Wikipedia page". As reported by several users in the comment section, the author's call-to-action (of sorts) prompted editor Hameltion to add new information to the Personal life section of his Wikipedia article, so that the "ridiculous" milestone could be celebrated properly. In the words of Green himself, "The ridiculous is perilously close to the sublime!" – O

In brief

Wikipedia correctly provided information on The Godfather's lead actor, unlike CNN's recent AI query (director's casting notes shown, with Marlon Brando underlined in red)



Do you want to contribute to "In the media" by writing a story or even just an "in brief" item? Edit next week's edition in the Newsroom or leave a tip on the suggestions page.


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Musk's complaints had validity, in as much as we were, in several articles, saying he did a "Nazi salute" without qualification. Adding "what some considered" or "what many categorized as a Nazi salute" would have gone a long way, but oh no... the encyclopedia, in Wiki voice, insisted on saying Musk did a "Nazi salute". Bra fuckin' vo. Marcus Markup (talk) 10:05, 7 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Note that only 45min after your comment, the move debate settled on Elon Musk salute controversy to neutrally report that Musk made a salute, but whether it was Nazi or Roman is under debate. As Smallbones explains, the case that this was a Nazi salute is much stronger than the rebuttal than it wasn't, yet Wikipedia's processes still settled on a neutral title. Musk seems to be hoping for no mention of criticism whatsoever. ViridianPenguin🐧 (💬) 01:25, 8 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  • A very weak answer, you gotta do better than that when accusing editors of BLP violations. The 1st edit at Nazi salute about Musk [4]
    • "On January 20, 2025 at a rally shortly after the second inauguration of Donald Trump, Elon Musk gave a speech during which he appeared to make two fascist or Nazi salutes. Musk has not yet directly commented.[106][107] Neo-Nazis and white nationalists reportedly celebrated Musk's salutes.[108]"
  • So 3 sources (TIME, The Guardian, Rolling Stone) were properly referenced. “he appeared to make …”, not a direct statement in Wikivoice, just a mild summary of what the sources wrote. Where’s the BLP violation?
  • Well, it was reverted 3 minutes later, based on nothing but the reverter’s opinion [5]
  • As far as the RfC you are claiming - it was withdrawn/changed right at the start to be a simple discussion. In any case it hasn’t been closed. It was long and almost devoid of BLP discusion - just one mention of BLP. “I even think that it potentially has BLP problems for it to be listed on the Nazi salute article when it was probably something completely innocent.” - pure unsupported opinion. Instead people were essentially just saying that they hadn’t seen anything like a Nazi salute, or that it wasn’t notable. Pure delusion IMHO.
  • So before you make any claims about editors violating WP:BLP, give an example. Smallbones(smalltalk) 00:34, 10 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Well, regardless of what Musk is or did, I think he might be right in that Wikipedia is sometimes an extension of traditional media, inasmuch as we often consider citations to said media as "reliable sources", at least in eswiki. Sophivorus (talk) 12:48, 7 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

That is by design and by purpose. Traditional media, including university press and such when we can get it, are our house-gods. This make us wide-open to Professor values, but the internet is vast and there are plenty of other websites. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 15:57, 7 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

What irked Musk so much is that Wikipedia is not for sale and there is not enough money he can accrue to buy Wikipedia off. The decision to never allow any advertising on Wikipedia and never sell Wikipedia off really paid off - Wikipedia has no price tag at all. His efforts to prevent donation to Wikipedia will not work either. Most of his base probably never donated to Wikipedia at the first place. And even in the event of massive downturn of donation the cost to run Wikipedia servers are quite low. We can survive with lower donation. Wikipedia isn't run by CEOs or some big suits who earned millions of dollar each year. ✠ SunDawn ✠ (contact) 16:53, 7 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

If a Nazi's mad at us, we must be doing something right! Whoop whoop pull up ♀️ Bitching Betty 🏳️‍⚧️ Averted crashes ⚧️ 00:48, 8 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Tesla and unions is going to appear on the Main Page in 11 days. Can't wait to see what he says then. Is he going to call Wikipedia communist propaganda? We'll have to wait and see. 💽 🌙Eclipse 💽 🌹 ⚧ (she/they/it) talk/edits 16:28, 9 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Dawn of the final day: 24 hours remain. 🌙Eclipse (she/they/all neostalkedits) 14:12, 19 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Hopefully he does not cut the million dollar check I received from USAID to publish this communist propaganda. ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 19:41, 9 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
You only got a million? Try asking social security! :p Smallbones(smalltalk) 21:13, 9 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]
I am opening a Requested move discussion to rename social security to socialist security, nothing a 19 year old and red-bull couldn't fix break though ~ 🦝 Shushugah (he/him • talk) 00:15, 10 February 2025 (UTC)[reply]



       

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